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Brake Performance, Need Help/Advice

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539
687
Exp. Type
Time Attack
Exp. Level
3-5 Years
SoCal
Hey TMO family, I have a brake question for you all, but first some back story.

I'm somewhat new to the track life, did my first event last May with a bone stock car. Since then, I've tried to make sure my brakes are up to the challenge. Currently, my brake setup is as follows: factory Brembo calipers, G-LOC R12/10, Motul RBF600, Vorshlag deflectors, and finally cheap Centric C-Tek rotors. I've been trying to maintain some sort of budget (though we all know how difficult that is) and that included going cheap on the rotors. A friend recommended these rotors to me and said he has been using them for years for track duty without issue. I have done 1 day at Chuckwalla and 2 days at Willow Springs (Big Willow) on this exact setup and my rotors look smeared with pad material. Does this mean they are getting too hot?? I believe my pads, fluid, and cooling deflectors should be sufficient but maybe these rotors can't handle the heat??

I'm also feeling a slight osculation or pulsating feeling in the pedal under hard braking. Similar to having multiple pad compounds on the rotors (I've done that before) but I know that is not the case. These are brand new pads on brand new rotors.

Any help/advice would be greatly appreciated! I'll try to upload a picture of the rotors when I get home today.
 
1,289
1,113
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
5-10 Years
Philly Metro Area
I would use at least Centric's Premium 12061089 rotor instead of the 121 series C-Tek rotor.

Here is a good summary of the differences.


If available, I would try to get the 125 series Centric High Carbon Premium
rotors

 
539
687
Exp. Type
Time Attack
Exp. Level
3-5 Years
SoCal
I would use at least Centric's Premium 12061089 rotor instead of the 121 series C-Tek rotor.

Here is a good summary of the differences.


If available, I would try to get the 125 series Centric High Carbon Premium
rotors

Thanks for the info! I almost purchased the high carbons the first time around but figured I'd give these a try since they're so cheap.

Now I know a floating rotor would be ideal (Steeda, Girodisc, AP Racing) but are they worth the premium price? Being 4x more expensive, do they perform 4x better than say the Centric High Carbons?
 
1,289
1,113
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
5-10 Years
Philly Metro Area
Just realized you're in an S550. The part number I referenced is for an S197 with 14" rotors. Use whatever appropriate P/N applies for your car.

I don't have any experience with 2-piece rotors. They help with weight and probably heat dissipation. Others can chime in but my guess is if you're just getting started it's overkill. Especially if you're on a such a budget that you had to resort to the C-Tek version rotors.

I would suggest spending the money on instruction and seat time. Otherwise you may develop (or already have) habits that may increase the brake overheating you're spending money to overcome.

For example, braking early and for a longer duration prior to a turn will generate much more heat than braking later, but harder, for a shorter duration.
 
539
687
Exp. Type
Time Attack
Exp. Level
3-5 Years
SoCal
Just realized you're in an S550. The part number I referenced is for an S197 with 14" rotors. Use whatever appropriate P/N applies for your car.

I don't have any experience with 2-piece rotors. They help with weight and probably heat dissipation. Others can chime in but my guess is if you're just getting started it's overkill. Especially if you're on a such a budget that you had to resort to the C-Tek version rotors.

I would suggest spending the money on instruction and seat time. Otherwise you may develop (or already have) habits that may increase the brake overheating you're spending money to overcome.

For example, braking early and for a longer duration prior to a turn will generate much more heat than braking later, but harder, for a shorter duration.
Understood 👍
I appreciate the advice and input. I'm trying to spend my money on as much seat time as I can over parts this year. Learning from my mistake purchases
 
539
687
Exp. Type
Time Attack
Exp. Level
3-5 Years
SoCal
Just realized you're in an S550. The part number I referenced is for an S197 with 14" rotors. Use whatever appropriate P/N applies for your car.

I don't have any experience with 2-piece rotors. They help with weight and probably heat dissipation. Others can chime in but my guess is if you're just getting started it's overkill. Especially if you're on a such a budget that you had to resort to the C-Tek version rotors.

I would suggest spending the money on instruction and seat time. Otherwise you may develop (or already have) habits that may increase the brake overheating you're spending money to overcome.

For example, braking early and for a longer duration prior to a turn will generate much more heat than braking later, but harder, for a shorter duration.
Happy Monday,

I was looking into other rotor options; what's your opinion on the follow rotors?
1. Centric 125 Series
2. DBA T3 4000 Series
3. Stoptech Slotted

Any one of those stand out as superior to the rest? Thank you in advance
 

Apex Wheels

Race Proven, Street Approved
Supporting Vendor
670
1,061
Exp. Type
Time Attack
Exp. Level
5-10 Years
Bay Area, CA
Happy Monday,

I was looking into other rotor options; what's your opinion on the follow rotors?
1. Centric 125 Series
2. DBA T3 4000 Series
3. Stoptech Slotted

Any one of those stand out as superior to the rest? Thank you in advance

I ran the DBA T3 rotors on my personal car with the factory Brembo calipers and they were excellent. On the rear I ran Stoptech slotted and it was also good. Both were put on at the same time and when removed, the rears were both cracked and the fronts had an impressive amount of life left in them. I know it's difficult to compared front and rears, but I would venture to say the DBA's are better.
 
539
687
Exp. Type
Time Attack
Exp. Level
3-5 Years
SoCal
I ran the DBA T3 rotors on my personal car with the factory Brembo calipers and they were excellent. On the rear I ran Stoptech slotted and it was also good. Both were put on at the same time and when removed, the rears were both cracked and the fronts had an impressive amount of life left in them. I know it's difficult to compared front and rears, but I would venture to say the DBA's are better.
Thanks for the info! I think I'll be trying the DBA ones next time around.

In your experience, what would be a good brake pad/rotor combo for someone looking for longevity in HPDE events? I'm not looking to set the fastest lap times, I just want something cost effective that will last a long time while I get practice and seat time.
 
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1,289
1,113
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
5-10 Years
Philly Metro Area
The DBA rotors mainly because of their "Kangaroo Paw" cooling vanes they are probably better than the other two choices.

Having said that, I have used the StopTech slotted for several years and they have been great. I do have brake ducts and there is no cracking. After my first 1-2 track days I will replace them with StopTech Cryo Treated Slotted Rotors. They supposedly last longer. They are available from TireRack.

As far as slotted vs. plain, I did it mostly for the looks but the slots do provide a little extra bite - along with slightly more brake dust.

For your learning process you can't go wrong with the PowerStop Track Day pads and any one of the rotors above.
 
1,289
1,113
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
5-10 Years
Philly Metro Area
OP, since you already are familiar with Vorshlag go to their blog and search for Centric in their S197 Track Car blog. You'll see Terry is a big fan of the Centric Premium plain rotors.

The StopTech slotted rotors are simply Centric Premium rotors with slots. RockAuto has the best prices on the Centric Plain rotors but they no longer carry the StopTech rotors. They may be phasing out their Centric Premiums too. TireRack has both.
 
539
687
Exp. Type
Time Attack
Exp. Level
3-5 Years
SoCal
OP, since you already are familiar with Vorshlag go to their blog and search for Centric in their S197 Track Car blog. You'll see Terry is a big fan of the Centric Premium plain rotors.

The StopTech slotted rotors are simply Centric Premium rotors with slots. RockAuto has the best prices on the Centric Plain rotors but they no longer carry the StopTech rotors. They may be phasing out their Centric Premiums too. TireRack has both.
This may be redundant but just for clarification purposes, are the Centric "Premiums" and the "125 High Carbon" rotors the same thing or different products?
 
2,198
1,065
Bay Area
@Ewheels I did notice that you wanted to try to keep your set up on a budget and that a fine line with brakes. I use GLoc R12/10 with giro disc rotors on the front and stock rotors on the rear. So far I have 4 track days on the set up and the rotors are great. (1 at WSIR big track and 3 at Sonoma). They don't increase your braking but the longevity is worth it to me. The pads new come at 12mm and the fronts are at 9mm and the rears are at 10mm. Granted the giro disc are about $1100 new and $800 to replace but again they will last roughly 4 times the life of a stock rotor. Then I swap to GS1 pads and back to stock rotors for street duty. FWIW I hope that helps you figure out which direction you want to go.

EDIT- I forgot to mention I also do use Ti heat shields all around.
 
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TMSBOSS

Spending my pension on car parts and track fees.
7,530
5,247
Exp. Type
HPDE
Exp. Level
10-20 Years
Illinois
I have used the DBA rotors with excellent results. One Small observation. They are a bit thicker than most rotors. New pads fit fine. New pads and titanium insulator shims do not fit. Run the pads a bit and the shims fit fine.
 

Apex Wheels

Race Proven, Street Approved
Supporting Vendor
670
1,061
Exp. Type
Time Attack
Exp. Level
5-10 Years
Bay Area, CA
Thanks for the info! I think I'll be trying the DBA ones next time around.

In your experience, what would be a good brake pad/rotor combo for someone looking for longevity in HPDE events? I'm not looking to set the fastest lap times, I just want something cost effective that will last a long while while I get practice and seat time.

Centric rotors and Raybestos ST43 pads would be a great setup, or the DBA rotors if you don't mind spending a little more. I love the ST43-47 pads, wear well, don't kill rotors, and great stopping power. Much better all around than Carbotech/GLoc in my experience. Match pads to the tires though, I was running slicks with 47s and it was nice, but when I went back to NT01s with 47s still in there they would trigger ABS occasionally.

Getting some Ti shims would be a good idea too, I also used them with the factory 4 pot calipers.
 
539
687
Exp. Type
Time Attack
Exp. Level
3-5 Years
SoCal
Centric rotors and Raybestos ST43 pads would be a great setup, or the DBA rotors if you don't mind spending a little more. I love the ST43-47 pads, wear well, don't kill rotors, and great stopping power. Much better all around than Carbotech/GLoc in my experience. Match pads to the tires though, I was running slicks with 47s and it was nice, but when I went back to NT01s with 47s still in there they would trigger ABS occasionally.

Getting some Ti shims would be a good idea too, I also used them with the factory 4 pot calipers.
Appreciate the advice!
The DBA fronts are only $30 more than the Centric 125 series so I'll just go with the DBAs. I've been reading more and more that the G-LOC pads perform well but don't last that long compared to other brands, and I've seen nothing but praise for the Raybestos pads. Would the ST43 or ST45 be more similar to the G-LOC R12s that I have now?
 

Apex Wheels

Race Proven, Street Approved
Supporting Vendor
670
1,061
Exp. Type
Time Attack
Exp. Level
5-10 Years
Bay Area, CA
Appreciate the advice!
The DBA fronts are only $30 more than the Centric 125 series so I'll just go with the DBAs. I've been reading more and more that the G-LOC pads perform well but don't last that long compared to other brands, and I've seen nothing but praise for the Raybestos pads. Would the ST43 or ST45 be more similar to the G-LOC R12s that I have now?
I think the ST43s would have a similar Mu to the R12s. But they would be able to hold that over a wider temp range.
 

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