S197 My budget track 5.0 GT Build Thread Profile - S197 Mustangs

[Kona.coyote5.0]

Looks good. Have you installed the extended studs on the front and gotten the spacers needed fit them yet?

Yes extended studs up front and the spacers are on order. Hoping to get extended studs for the rear as well just for the added strength.

 

[Kona.coyote5.0]

Well I pulled the trigger on suspension and this being a budget track build did not go with $5000 coilovers. Sorry guys. Disappointing I know. I might regret it and end up buying coilovers eventually, but I also may just as well get a different track car for all I know. I want to get some seat time and get the most bang for my buck. After much back and forth I decided to go with the Vorshlag Bilstein Streetpro kit (Bilstein monotube shocks/struts with Eibach Pro kit springs and Vorshlag camer plates) which already comes assembled and ready to install. I was deciding between this kit and Koni yellows with other lowering springs but decided to go with this kit as I've read mixed things about the Koni yellows and only great things about the monotube design of the Bilsteins. This combo should give me 1 inch drop in the front with 1.5 inches in the rear.

I also installed a Whiteline adjustable panhard bar, Whiteline adjustable lower control arms with relocation brackets, Whiteline adjustable rear upper control arm, and Whiteline front/rear adjustable sway bars.

I am mad at myself for even considering paying someone to install this for me. The job was a breeze and with the help of a five minute youtube clip I got it done. Even cut my strut towers to maximize the amount of camber I can get.

Car will be going to get a full race alignment later this month and should be all dialed in before April.

 

[CYCLN3.7]

Watching this thread now. First post I’ve seen but you’ve done the same suspension mods I’d like to try. Would love to hear your thoughts on the Vorshlag set up! Mainly the Bilsteins!

 

[Kona.coyote5.0]

Watching this thread now. First post I’ve seen but you’ve done the same suspension mods I’d like to try. Would love to hear your thoughts on the Vorshlag set up! Mainly the Bilsteins!

Will keep you posted- more pictures to come too once everything is dialed in and the car is sitting right. Have an appointment at a race shop a couple weeks from now. Would like to get on track at Gingerman (have the most experience there) to see how different the car feels and get used to it before I go to unfamiliar tracks. I will be doing most track days at Autobahn country club this year (less than an hour from me) but I have yet to go there.

Initial impressions of the parts though- the camber plates are very well made and very high quality. Super easy to adjust yourself as well. I am going to have the shop do the alignment with a street setting and then an aggressive camber track setting that I can adjust to once I get to the track.

 

[blacksheep-1]

Working on your own stuff is very rewarding, designing, picking out parts, installing them and seeing the results is quite a catharsis...

 

[302BOB]

, installing them and seeing the results is quite a catharsis...

Hon, Where's the dictionary???.......I'm sure "catharsis" is a good thing....................

 

[stevbd]

@Kona.coyote5.0 I used that exact Vorshlag kit for many years and track days, it was great. Biggest improvements were good shocks and camber plates. I think and hope you will like it also.

 

[stevbd]

By the way, @Kona.coyote5.0 you also mention alignment settings....

On the advice of Vorshlag when I bought their StreetPro kit I put the camber plates in the max upright position and then got the toe aligned to zero. That is your street setting. When you go to the track you move the cc plates to max negative camber which also gives a toe-out setting that helps with turn in.

I was laughing when I asked Vorshlag for a good neg camber setting for track days and they responded, "all of it." Gotta love Texas. But in my experience it really is true, you can't get too much front neg camber on these cars at least not with the stock shock towers. They also sell a jig to cut those btw.

 

[Kona.coyote5.0]

By the way, @Kona.coyote5.0 you also mention alignment settings....

On the advice of Vorshlag when I bought their StreetPro kit I put the camber plates in the max upright position and then got the toe aligned to zero. That is your street setting. When you go to the track you move the cc plates to max negative camber which also gives a toe-out setting that helps with turn in.

I was laughing when I asked Vorshlag for a good neg camber setting for track days and they responded, "all of it." Gotta love Texas. But in my experience it really is true, you can't get too much front neg camber on these cars at least not with the stock shock towers. They also sell a jig to cut those btw.

Good info. I will make sure to run this by the shop. And yes great tool for the shock towers- I bought one from them and used it to cut. It’s in a couple of the pics above.

 

[mat33]

I've been very happy with a similar build. I already had the MM camber plates. I went with H&R Race front springs on the Bilstein struts. I opted for Koni Yellow in the rear to be able to dial the damping in a little and the Bilstein Struts seem to be a bigger benefit on the front. I also went with the MM adjustable rear spring perch and some 250 lb/in coilover springs that I can swap out easily if I want.

Just curious if you also did anything to correct geometry. I did go with Rear LCA Relocation brackets, extended ball joints on the front and a bump steer kit. If you didn't, I would be interested to hear how it worked because I also have a V6 that I might go a bit milder (less drop and not as stiff) on.

 

[Kona.coyote5.0]

I've been very happy with a similar build. I already had the MM camber plates. I went with H&R Race front springs on the Bilstein struts. I opted for Koni Yellow in the rear to be able to dial the damping in a little and the Bilstein Struts seem to be a bigger benefit on the front. I also went with the MM adjustable rear spring perch and some 250 lb/in coilover springs that I can swap out easily if I want.

Just curious if you also did anything to correct geometry. I did go with Rear LCA Relocation brackets, extended ball joints on the front and a bump steer kit. If you didn't, I would be interested to hear how it worked because I also have a V6 that I might go a bit milder (less drop and not as stiff) on.

So here’s a dumb question but I have been meaning to read up on- what would be the difference between extended ball joints and beefier front control arms with extended ball joints already installed? Just strength? Are extended ball joints in the stock control arms much more affordable?

 

[EF1]

The engineers at Ford used the stock front control arms on the various S197 race cars with different ball joints and they could have used whatever they wanted on these cars since they were not worried about warranty or DOT safety standards. I have never tried any of the tubular front control arms, but I have seen pictures of some that were bent/broken.

 

[stevbd]

@Kona.coyote5.0 my understanding is stock control arms with stock ball joints are the strongest option. You don't need extended ball joints with mild lowering springs and the peace of mind of not worrying about ball joints snapping is worth at least a couple seconds per lap at least to me.

Check out this thread starting at post #23, post #40 summarizes the problem: https://trackmustangsonline.com/threads/howe-extended-ball-joints.17544/page-2

Extended ball joints obviously are helpful for the real racers who check them constantly but no need imo for an HPDE guy like myself.

 

[EF1]

Howe ball joints are just another wear item. Part of your pre track routine should include checking them for wear just like wheel bearings or brakes. They also require periodic greasing and torquing just like other suspension components. The good thing is they are much easier to change than pressed in ball joints,.

 

[Proto]

@Kona.coyote5.0 I have really close to the same setup except for Cortex arms and relocation brackets. With the Vorshlag Streetpros I max out on camber at -2.9. I had contacted Vorshlag about converting the setup to the TrackPro specs they used to sell but they said I was better off just spending the money on coilovers. Too much time and money to do it. I think I do pretty well with the setup. If anything, my driving skills need ever more work. I need to get down to SoloPerformance and get a track alignment. I had an offroad excursion the day after christmas and tore one of my Cortex Track LCAs up. Ended up moving over to the Steet version. You should check out Champaign Country Sports Car Club for events. It has been the main place I autocross. Events in Rantoul.

 

[Kona.coyote5.0]

@Kona.coyote5.0 I have really close to the same setup except for Cortex arms and relocation brackets. With the Vorshlag Streetpros I max out on camber at -2.9. I had contacted Vorshlag about converting the setup to the TrackPro specs they used to sell but they said I was better off just spending the money on coilovers. Too much time and money to do it. I think I do pretty well with the setup. If anything, my driving skills need ever more work. I need to get down to SoloPerformance and get a track alignment. I had an offroad excursion the day after christmas and tore one of my Cortex Track LCAs up. Ended up moving over to the Steet version. You should check out Champaign Country Sports Car Club for events. It has been the main place I autocross. Events in Rantoul.

2.9 sounds great! Hoping I can get the same out of mine. What size tire are you running? Seems that this set up is more common on this forum than I thought. Was trying to dig into the forum and find more people with the set up before making my decision and it was hard to do.

Yeah agreed on the coilovers. As awesome as it would be, I just do not have the time and ability to make that commitment right now just starting out in the hobby. At this stage improving my driving skills will get me much better lap time improvements than coilovers can.

Will definitely keep Champaign Country Sports Car Club in mind. Really enjoying the HDPE events and have not given much thought to autocross events yet. Seems like a really good opportunity to hone your skills though.

 

[stevbd]

@Kona.coyote5.0, with that Vorshlag kit you got I started out with a 275/40/18 square setup and then went 305/30/19 square. No rubbing at all with proper front spacers, extended hubs, and ~-3 degrees front camber.

 

[Proto]

For autocross I swap on a set of 19x11s with 305 Rt660s. 1" Spacers with extended lugs

I have been wanting to try out out track days but have been too focused in autocross.

 

[Kona.coyote5.0]

Took the car to Ultima Race Works in crystal lake to get a full race alignment done. Nothing but great things to say about those guys. Very professional and they know their stuff. The car is dialed in, set for -2 degrees for the street and can be adjusted at the track for -3. The Apex EC7’s look great with the 305 square hankook RS4s on all four corners. The guys at URW had me go with 15mm H&R Trak+ front spacers to clear the struts and Brembos and I am amazed at how flush the front wheels are. There is barely any poke- they fit great. I was expecting at least an inch of poke from what I’ve seen and read here.

Starting the season a bit late, first event is at Gingerman on 5/14, but I am registered for 8 track days so far this year through September. Might get to 10 when all said and done.

 

[Kona.coyote5.0]

Finally got out for the first time this year a couple weeks ago at Gingerman Raceway. I wanted to go to the track I had experience on and see how different the car feels with all the work done. The car feels completely different with the 305 square set of Hankook RS4's on the apex wheels on top of the camber and suspension. To be completely honest I feel like I didn't even get close to pushing the car to the limit. It had so much grip that I kept pushing it harder and harder around the corners each session and it kept handling the turns like I wanted.

A little embarrassed with my lap times but hey, at least there was improvement throughout the day. Next track day is in a couple weeks at Autobahn Country Club closer to home. I opted to have an instructor for the day since it will be my first time on that track. Cannot wait to get back out with the car.