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Possible bent subframe or any other components

Hello, I hit a curb on my 5.0. I took it in to a shop to get an alignment done & they said my caster was off & couldn’t be adjusted. My left caster was 7.4 & right caster was 5.4. Everything else was fine. It pulls to the right a little but they said it could be subframe Damage. I took it for a second opinion and they couldn’t see any frame damage was well as my personal mechanic. They both said it could be my control arms, spindle, or wheel bearing. I’m taking it to a body shop to see what’s really wrong but just want to hear worst case scenarios. Thanks!
Here’s my before & after alignment

ADA24710-8400-4EA3-BD70-DC521489E537.jpeg
 
Holy crap, that bottom is the after? 1.2deg of cross camber? And the rear toe?

Something is bent on the right front. Least likely would be the subframe, but check the control arms, strut and spindle carefully for damage/bent.

After you find the bent part, find a better alignment shop.

DaveW
 
Taking it to a body shop tomorrow morning to actually get it looked at by someone who knows what they’re looking for! Thanks very much! I’ll keep y’all updated with the good news/bad news
 
Holy crap, that bottom is the after? 1.2deg of cross camber? And the rear toe?

Something is bent on the right front. Least likely would be the subframe, but check the control arms, strut and spindle carefully for damage/bent.

After you find the bent part, find a better alignment shop.

DaveW
What did you mean by the bottom is the after? I’m confused
 
What did you mean by the bottom is the after? I’m confused
The bottom of the printout is the measurements after the alignment was completed?
Assuming yes, that "finished" alignment, while in the green, is barely good enough for a minivan, much less a performance car. FInd another alignment shop.
DaveW
 
The bottom of the printout is the measurements after the alignment was completed?
Assuming yes, that "finished" alignment, while in the green, is barely good enough for a minivan, much less a performance car. FInd another alignment shop.
DaveW
Hey sorry for the late response. So I went to a body shop, they said it was the strut and controls arms. So I bought a new OEM strut and bought the Ford Performance package controls arms for both sides. I then got an alignment and the cars steering wheel still turns to the right slightly when driving. The right tire also sits closer to the fender like before. Is it really possible it’s subframe damage? Or any other parts that I missed?
 
I haven’t checked the k member. And I’m going back to the place for another alignment because they forgot to print out the sheet(at no charge). I’m gonna tell them to check the k member, steering rack. I’m also wondering since I upgraded the control arms to the ford performance packages. Could that result in all other OEM parts to perform like crap? Like the tie rods for example.
 
Hey sorry for the late response. So I went to a body shop, they said it was the strut and controls arms. So I bought a new OEM strut and bought the Ford Performance package controls arms for both sides. I then got an alignment and the cars steering wheel still turns to the right slightly when driving. The right tire also sits closer to the fender like before. Is it really possible it’s subframe damage? Or any other parts that I missed?
There is a lot going on here.

First, let's clear up the actual issue. After an alignment, the car should both drive straight down the road with no pull and the steering wheel should be level. To check for a pull, you take your hands off the wheel on straight level road and see where the car goes. The steering wheel being level is easier/more obvious, when held level the car should be going straight down the same level road. The important thing there, and something I see/hear a lot, is holding the wheel straight and the car going one direction is NOT a pull and can cause some confusion in diagnosis. It is not entirely unusual for a steering wheel to be unlevel after an alignment, there are a lot of dynamic forces in play on both ends of the car that are hard to measure on the machine and this condition is typically corrected after a test drive.

Given what the alignment shop sent you home with the first time, they are suspect to begin with. You need to see the current alignment numbers to go further here. Both your caster and camber numbers should be within a few tenths of a degree side to side. Certainly, no more than .5 different. The caster is not easily adjustable, but the camber has some factory adjustment/slop. Both can be adjusted with a crash bolt kit.

Next step is to get the current numbers and see where those cross camber and caster numbers are at. If the caster is still off like above, something is still tweaked. Finding what is bent without a frame table and the factory measurements maybe tough, especially without a good car to compare too.

The current alignment numbers will tell the story. IF things are just a little off, yes, something got slightly bent but it can probably all be corrected with some crash bolts and someone caring about the alignment.

Good luck.

DaveW
 
That caster should make it pull left not right. And why is the toe screwed up in the after?

you seriously need a better shop. shiznit alignments, forgetting the printout, it’s pretty sketchy
 
There is a lot going on here.

First, let's clear up the actual issue. After an alignment, the car should both drive straight down the road with no pull and the steering wheel should be level. To check for a pull, you take your hands off the wheel on straight level road and see where the car goes. The steering wheel being level is easier/more obvious, when held level the car should be going straight down the same level road. The important thing there, and something I see/hear a lot, is holding the wheel straight and the car going one direction is NOT a pull and can cause some confusion in diagnosis. It is not entirely unusual for a steering wheel to be unlevel after an alignment, there are a lot of dynamic forces in play on both ends of the car that are hard to measure on the machine and this condition is typically corrected after a test drive.

Given what the alignment shop sent you home with the first time, they are suspect to begin with. You need to see the current alignment numbers to go further here. Both your caster and camber numbers should be within a few tenths of a degree side to side. Certainly, no more than .5 different. The caster is not easily adjustable, but the camber has some factory adjustment/slop. Both can be adjusted with a crash bolt kit.

Next step is to get the current numbers and see where those cross camber and caster numbers are at. If the caster is still off like above, something is still tweaked. Finding what is bent without a frame table and the factory measurements maybe tough, especially without a good car to compare too.

The current alignment numbers will tell the story. IF things are just a little off, yes, something got slightly bent but it can probably all be corrected with some crash bolts and someone caring about the alignment.

Good luck.

DaveW
That caster should make it pull left not right. And why is the toe screwed up in the after?

you seriously need a better shop. shiznit alignments, forgetting the printout, it’s pretty sketchy
Yeah it pulls right, when letting go of the steering wheel, it turns right like an inch or two. Makes it feel like my car is crab-walking I guess. I’m gonna have to find a better alignment shop. This is the second one I’ve been too
 
That caster should make it pull left not right. And why is the toe screwed up in the after?

you seriously need a better shop. shiznit alignments, forgetting the printout, it’s pretty sketchy
Okay after reading. There’s a big difference between pull and drift. Let me correct myself

The vehicle doesn’t pull. It wanders and drifts slightly to right when letting go on an even road. Going over bumps or little lumps on roads. The vehicle pulls weird the right. Could subframe cause that negative caster?
 
Okay after reading. There’s a big difference between pull and drift. Let me correct myself

The vehicle doesn’t pull. It wanders and drifts slightly to right when letting go on an even road. Going over bumps or little lumps on roads. The vehicle pulls weird the right. Could subframe cause that negative caster?
Speaking of sketchy, I mis-spoke above. The car pulls to the side with less caster/more positive camber so yes, I think your caster is at least part of your issue. -1.7 difference side to side is a decent amount, not yank the wheel out of your hand type, but enough to cause a drift.

I don't like all the toe in either, but that won't cause a pull though it could *maybe* cause some of the bump issue.

Since you replaced the control arms and struts, the only things left are the spindle and k-member. In my experience, the spindle is a lot easier to bend than the k-member, but maybe the race guys here have more experience on that.

I have no idea how to see the bend in either of those items without known good ones to compare to. The ford crash bolt kit would probably get your caster close enough to drive straight. If the right side won't come up to match the left, they could lower the left a little - the more important thing is they match and if that ends up at 6.5ish degrees, so be it. Caster is not a tire wearing angle.


For the rest of your alignment, you really want a little bit of negative camber*matched* on both sides. -1.2 was a good start before someone corrected them both to around zero. :(

Finally for toe, you want about 1/32" toe in total, maybe 1/16. I am not sure WTF they are doing setting it at 5/32, that is a LOT.

DaveW
 
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Exp. Type
W2W Racing
Exp. Level
20+ Years
Snowy North
Interesting thread, but I need to ask two things;

1) What the H3LL kinda curb did you hit to cause this apparent carnage, and...
2) How fast...to do this w/o cracking or bending a rim, popping a strut/top mount, etc???

Might be a good idea to visit a reputable dealer to get a baseline vs trial-and-error shopping for advice at bodyshops and alignment stores...;););)
 

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