Dyno Plug and traction/stability control? What's the deal?

[Randomtask]

After experiencing 'power loss' on some corner exits, I started down the rabbit hole of this dyno plug business. Does anyone have a definitive answer on what pulling the plug actually disables? I can't find a thread that fully lays it out in real world experience.

All nannies are as off as I can get them, it happens on right or left high G load corners, and with or without a full tank of gas. I still think traction/stability control is messing with the car, and a combination of the 100TW tires, extra wheel width and camber are allowing higher loads on the car, and it doesn't like it.

FYI it's a 2021 mach 1, running 19x11 square, Supercar3r tires, -3.1/-2.3 camber. Carbotech XP12 pads. My latest lap times for info are around a 2.30 at COTA, 2.26 at MSRC, and 2.08 at ECR CCW.

 

[mavisky]

I believe pulling that fuse may disable ABS as well so may not be the best solution. I know some people have had issues with Magneride and lithium batteries. Are you still on the stock battery?

 

[Stan Whitney]

After experiencing 'power loss' on some corner exits, I started down the rabbit hole of this dyno plug business. Does anyone have a definitive answer on what pulling the plug actually disables? I can't find a thread that fully lays it out in real world experience.

All nannies are as off as I can get them, it happens on right or left high G load corners, and with or without a full tank of gas. I still think traction/stability control is messing with the car, and a combination of the 100TW tires, extra wheel width and camber are allowing higher loads on the car, and it doesn't like it.

FYI it's a 2021 mach 1, running 19x11 square, Supercar3r tires, -3.1/-2.3 camber. Carbotech XP12 pads. My latest lap times for info are around a 2.30 at COTA, 2.26 at MSRC, and 2.08 at ECR CCW.

Which corners at ECR and MSRC? 3rd or 2nd gear? On the gt350s I used to just disable traction control, still stayed in track mode (stabilitrac, yaw control) On those tracks and it would allow any desired amount of wheelspin off the corners.

 

[Randomtask]

I believe pulling that fuse may disable ABS as well so may not be the best solution. I know some people have had issues with Magneride and lithium batteries. Are you still on the stock battery?

Yes I’m still stock battery.

 

[Randomtask]

Which corners at ECR and MSRC? 3rd or 2nd gear? On the gt350s I used to just disable traction control, still stayed in track mode (stabilitrac, yaw control) On those tracks and it would allow any desired amount of wheelspin off the corners.

ECR, CCW turn 5, it’s a right, out of the dip and up the hill. Turn 10, a left into the back strait. Turn 14, it’s a right out of the canyon and up the hill. Always on the exit.

MSRC, tombstone, it’s a left before big bend. That’s all I remember there. Not any high load sustained rights.

Gearing, any corners I can think of would have been 3rd or 4th.

 

[Mad Hatter]

Just in case, I would suggest logging the car while at the track. Your symptoms could be caused by timing being pulled either from false knock or some other issue. Have you done any transmission work lately? If so remember to check if the crank relearn was done..

 

[k_z]

After experiencing 'power loss' on some corner exits, I started down the rabbit hole of this dyno plug business. Does anyone have a definitive answer on what pulling the plug actually disables? I can't find a thread that fully lays it out in real world experience.

All nannies are as off as I can get them, it happens on right or left high G load corners, and with or without a full tank of gas. I still think traction/stability control is messing with the car, and a combination of the 100TW tires, extra wheel width and camber are allowing higher loads on the car, and it doesn't like it.

FYI it's a 2021 mach 1, running 19x11 square, Supercar3r tires, -3.1/-2.3 camber. Carbotech XP12 pads. My latest lap times for info are around a 2.30 at COTA, 2.26 at MSRC, and 2.08 at ECR CCW.

First - this isn't a fuse and it most definitely does not disable ABS. I've had the plug out for two years now. It disable Advance Trac, Traction Control and also (which may or may not be intended) disables steering angle broadcast on CAN bus - which may or may not be used by Magride - whether the calibration in Ford controller actually uses it I don't anyone other than Ford could tell you. I never had any issues with the plug out.

However - plug helps with situation where you get a message "Service Advancetrac" and car gets back to Normal mode (which on a Magride car sets suspension to softest mode) and turns Advance Trac and traction control back on. If you disabled Advance Trac (by holding the TC button for 7 seconds), were in a Track mode and did not get messages on the dash, what you felt was not an intervention of any of the car systems and pulling the plug isn't going to change anything (but feel free to try). Power loss at corner exit feels like Advancetrac intervention.

I think Mach 1 have "Service Advancetrac" problem solved. My car would do that on a regular basis on a bumpy autocross course with some (controlled) yaw - probably thinking I'm about to die.

 

[Randomtask]

First - this isn't a fuse and it most definitely does not disable ABS. I've had the plug out for two years now. It disable Advance Trac, Traction Control and also (which may or may not be intended) disables steering angle broadcast on CAN bus - which may or may not be used by Magride - whether the calibration in Ford controller actually uses it I don't anyone other than Ford could tell you. I never had any issues with the plug out.

However - plug helps with situation where you get a message "Service Advancetrac" and car gets back to Normal mode (which on a Magride car sets suspension to softest mode) and turns Advance Trac and traction control back on. If you disabled Advance Trac (by holding the TC button for 7 seconds), were in a Track mode and did not get messages on the dash, what you felt was not an intervention of any of the car systems and pulling the plug isn't going to change anything (but feel free to try). Power loss at corner exit feels like Advancetrac intervention.

I think Mach 1 have "Service Advancetrac" problem solved. My car would do that on a regular basis on a bumpy autocross course with some (controlled) yaw - probably thinking I'm about to die.

Ive never noticed the dash lighting up when the power loss happens, that being said, I'm exiting a corner that requires attention outside the car, and not looking inward.

And yes I run track mode and TC off hold for 7 seconds.

 

[k_z]

Ive never noticed the dash lighting up when the power loss happens, that being said, I'm exiting a corner that requires attention outside the car, and not looking inward.

And yes I run track mode and TC off hold for 7 seconds.

You wouldn't miss it - it's the message in a square frame and a chime that comes with it. I'd try with the plug out but I doubt it'll help with whatever you're experiencing - it basically removes necessity to hold the TC button for 7 seconds.

 

[Dave_W]

You mention it's happening with increased grip and high lateral loads. Depending on your front-to-rear roll stiffness, another cause could be reduced weight / vertical load on the inside rear, causing the inside rear to spin without driving the outside rear because the Torsen is past its torque bias ratio. If you datalog individual wheel speeds, you can see it easily.

If you datalog OBD-II channels, you may be able to see TCS/ESP "tell tale" alarms - AiM has them listed for the 2011+ S197s, don't know about the S550s. AiM "2011 Mustang" protocol channels -
ECU_16 M_ABS_EVENT ABS Event in progress
ECU_17 M_ESP_EVENT ESP Event in progress
ECU_41 M_ETC_TELTAL Engine traction control

 

[Randomtask]

You mention it's happening with increased grip and high lateral loads. Depending on your front-to-rear roll stiffness, another cause could be reduced weight / vertical load on the inside rear, causing the inside rear to spin without driving the outside rear because the Torsen is past its torque bias ratio. If you datalog individual wheel speeds, you can see it easily.

If you datalog OBD-II channels, you may be able to see TCS/ESP "tell tale" alarms - AiM has them listed for the 2011+ S197s, don't know about the S550s. AiM "2011 Mustang" protocol channels -
ECU_16 M_ABS_EVENT ABS Event in progress
ECU_17 M_ESP_EVENT ESP Event in progress
ECU_41 M_ETC_TELTAL Engine traction control

Very interested in this, I don't know if the Kiwi OBD2 tool I have includes this data, but I will look into it!

 

[Stan Whitney]

ECR, CCW turn 5, it’s a right, out of the dip and up the hill. Turn 10, a left into the back strait. Turn 14, it’s a right out of the canyon and up the hill. Always on the exit.

MSRC, tombstone, it’s a left before big bend. That’s all I remember there. Not any high load sustained rights.

Gearing, any corners I can think of would have been 3rd or 4th.

Following up on Dave W's mention of torsen wheelspin, I used to experience it on ECR T5 and T14 if I had my rear BMR swaybar set aggressively - mid position, and the front set on soft to mid. This surfaced after going to stickier RT660's, with the 3Rs you would be pulling even more Gs. I had to go with a stiffer front bar and softer rear bar setting to solve it. I was also on BMR springs.

 

[Randomtask]

Following up on Dave W's mention of torsen wheelspin, I used to experience it on ECR T5 and T14 if I had my rear BMR swaybar set aggressively - mid position, and the front set on soft to mid. This surfaced after going to stickier RT660's, with the 3Rs you would be pulling even more Gs. I had to go with a stiffer front bar and softer rear bar setting to solve it. I was also on BMR springs.

This sounds very relevant since during the early days of the car in 2021 I swapped out the base spec springs and rear bar the to the HP spec, just thinking I was going to benefit from the handling pack setup. It was basically slightly stiffer springs, but a very heavy solid rear bar, vs the oe hollow bar. (no change to the front bar though).

I can easily throw the oe back in and see what effect it has, before I go down any costly route. Presumably i'm going to end up with more understeer if I do that though.

 

[TennTex]

Hey Randomtask, chiming in because I also use the dynoplug and run the same tracks as you, with similar times (except COTA, it's been several years since I ran there). I ran a switch to the dynoplug, so I can do it once for the entire weekend and not have to mess with remembering to hold down buttons. My car is a bit older, a 2017 PP1, but I've never noticed any TC or Adv track issues popping up on track. I've also heard that ABS still works, but I can't really confirm this. My style is to not over-use the brakes, yet I've also managed to flat-spot a tire!

You mentioned specific turns at ECR & MSR-Cresson. You can find a thread where I added an additional fuel-pump to help with fuel starvation coming out of Tombstone, BUT this issue would only happen on high-G left hand turns. You describe it also happening on right handers, where I've never experienced issues. So, likely the folks above are onto something with the Torsen comments. I run Steeda bars from a few years back, full soft on rear and 2nd stiffest on the front. I also run their dual-rate springs. Your Mach 1 has more power, and maybe other factory differences to my PP1, so just some reference info just in case...

 

[Randomtask]

Hey Randomtask, chiming in because I also use the dynoplug and run the same tracks as you, with similar times (except COTA, it's been several years since I ran there). I ran a switch to the dynoplug, so I can do it once for the entire weekend and not have to mess with remembering to hold down buttons. My car is a bit older, a 2017 PP1, but I've never noticed any TC or Adv track issues popping up on track. I've also heard that ABS still works, but I can't really confirm this. My style is to not over-use the brakes, yet I've also managed to flat-spot a tire!

You mentioned specific turns at ECR & MSR-Cresson. You can find a thread where I added an additional fuel-pump to help with fuel starvation coming out of Tombstone, BUT this issue would only happen on high-G left hand turns. You describe it also happening on right handers, where I've never experienced issues. So, likely the folks above are onto something with the Torsen comments. I run Steeda bars from a few years back, full soft on rear and 2nd stiffest on the front. I also run their dual-rate springs. Your Mach 1 has more power, and maybe other factory differences to my PP1, so just some reference info just in case...

That’s all good info, thanks for chiming in. I’ll be trying the plug, along with looking at the bars. I’ll most likely pull the factory ones out and go with some adjustable ones to experiment. Suspension changes are next on the list anyway…..venting and aero is the current project, then I’ll have no choice but to get the suspension sorted.

It could be maybe I’ve experienced both the fuel starvation and the Torsen issue at separate times. It was last year, and I know I didn’t do any effective note taking or problem solving. I was just too busy having fun!!!